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Nghiên cứu Biển Đông: 'Đóng cửa đọc cho nhau nghe'

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altTS Hoàng Việt cho rằng, qua các hội thảo, các nhà hoạch định chính sách của từng nước tranh chấp chủ quyền trên Biển Đông có những điều chỉnh chính sách nhất định.

LTS: Tuanvietnam tiếp tục cuộc trò chuyện với Thạc sỹ Hoàng Việt

Các hội thảo quốc tế về Biển Đông này có ý nghĩa gì đối với giới học giả Việt Nam?

Cá nhân tôi học hỏi được khá nhiều, nếu không nói là rất nhiều. Bởi các nhà tổ chức đã mời được nhiều tên tuổi hàng đầu, tuy không phải tất cả, nhưng đại diện cho nhiều lĩnh vực khác nhau, từ chính trị học, quan hệ quốc tế, đến luật học...

Tôi theo dõi qua truyền thông thì thường thấy chủ yếu là học giả nước ngoài tranh luận với học giả Trung Quốc, mà hiếm thấy tên học giả Việt Nam?

Như vậy đỡ kẹt hơn cho ban tổ chức, phải không anh? (Cười lớn) Bởi học giả nước thứ ba được coi là có quan điểm khách quan hơn.

Tuy nhiên, tôi theo dõi các hội thảo, thấy học giả Việt Nam và Trung Quốc tranh luận nhiều khi rất gay gắt là đằng khác. Trong số các học giả Việt Nam tham dự hội thảo, luôn có những người bảo vệ quan điểm của Việt Nam. Chỉ hơi tiếc là vẫn chưa có nhiều gương mặt mới.

Ban Tổ chức, với tư cách chủ nhà, nhiều khi phải can thiệp để không khí tranh luận nhẹ nhàng hơn. Ngay cả giữa học giả Trung Quốc với học giả nước thứ ba. Tuy nhiên, bản thân các học giả vẫn có ý thức duy trì không khí học thuật.

Tức là sao?

Chẳng hạn, tôi đã chứng kiến cuộc tranh luận gay gắt giữa TS Vương Hàn Lĩnh của Trung Quốc với GS Peter Dutton của Học viện Hải quân Hoa Kỳ. Thế nhưng, sau đó vào giờ giải lao hai người lại bắt tay nhau và trò chuyện vui vẻ, cuối ngày còn cụng ly bia với nhau. Tôi nghĩ đó là biểu tượng của tình bạn giữa các nhà khoa học.

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Thạc sĩ Hoàng Việt và các đồng nghiệp Việt Nam bên lề hội thảo. Ảnh: Huỳnh Phan

Ồ, tôi còn có một món nợ TS Vương Hàn Lĩnh. Tôi đã hứa, trong cuộc phỏng vấn với ông tại Hội thảo quốc tế về chủ đề khai thác chung nguồn năng lượng ở châu Á (8.2010 tại TP HCM) rằng tôi sẽ sắp xếp để ông trao đổi với các học giả Việt Nam về khía cạnh lịch sử, thậm chí đã tìm được địa điểm thích hợp cho cuộc trao đổi này là quán cà phê Cây Khế ở Hà Nội. Thế mà không tìm thấy ông tại cuộc hội thảo năm ngoái tại Hà Nội.

Lần đó, tôi đã chứng kiến TS Vương Hàn Lĩnh phản biện rất gay gắt với trình bày của TS Trần Trường Thủy tại hội thảo đó, đến mức ông Đặng Đình Quý phải nhảy vào tiếp sức.

Vậy, không hiểu tại các hội thảo Biển Đông mà ông tham dự, các học giả Trung Quốc có phản biện mạnh mẽ các quan điểm của học giả Việt Nam không?

Theo quan sát của tôi, các học giả Trung Quốc tham dự các hội thảo chia làm một số nhóm. Nhóm trong hội thảo đầu tiên thì chỉ nói bằng tiếng Hoa, còn các hội thảo sau có những nhóm trẻ trung hơn, được đào tạo ở nước ngoài, nói tiếng Anh rất tốt, nên phản biện cũng rất dữ dội.

Tuy nhiên, phản biện của họ chỉ là sự lặp lại những gì mà xưa nay chính phủ họ vẫn nói, không có gì mới. Và, có lẽ vì vậy, cũng ít tính thuyết phục.

Liệu điều đó có làm cho những người tham dự, nhất là các học giả phương Tây, khó chịu không?

Tôi thấy nhiều khi các học giả phương Tây cũng nhăn mặt lại. Tôi nghĩ đây là chủ trương nhất quán của họ cả trong hội thảo lẫn bên ngoài. Họ làm cho các quốc gia liên quan khác chán nản, rồi buông xuôi mới thôi, tôi nghĩ vậy.

Ông có đồng ý với nhận xét của ông Phạm Hoàng Quân là Trung Quốc chủ yếu cử những người đấu tranh về lập trường quan điểm là chính, thay vì những nhà nghiên cứu có đẳng cấp thực sự?

Tôi xin lấy ví dụ về hai người hay đứng lên tranh luận là Tô Hạo và Vương Hàn Lĩnh.

Anh Vương Hàn Lĩnh mỗi khi giải thích về luật pháp, tôi thấy lập luận của anh ta ngược lại với luật quốc tế ghê gớm lắm. Thậm chí, anh ta còn đưa ra những điều không nằm trong luật luôn.

Còn Tô Hạo là dân ngoại giao, rất khéo lồng quan điểm vào bài tham luận hơn. Nhưng nghe kỹ thì cũng chỉ có chừng ấy thôi, chủ yếu là tuyên truyền đối ngoại cho chính phủ Trung Quốc, chứ ít tính khoa học.

Thế còn với những nhà nghiên cứu độc lập như ông, điều gì khiến ông phải bỏ tiền túi ra mua vé máy bay để ra Hà Nội để dự hội thảo lần thứ ba?

Tôi thu nhận được nhiều ý tưởng và tư liệu hay cho những bài viết sau này của mình. Mỗi học giả từ một quốc gia mang tới một cách nhìn khác về cùng một vấn đề, từ đó tạo ra một bức tranh tổng thể. Cá nhân tôi, sau ba hội thảo đã hiểu khá toàn diện về bức tranh về tranh chấp Biển Đông, không chỉ từ quan điểm của chúng ta, của Trung Quốc, mà còn từ cộng đồng thế giới.

Hơn nữa, khác với giới học giả Việt Nam vốn ít có tiếng nói với các nhà hoạch định chính sách, các học giả có tên tuổi của nhiều nước có tiếng nói khá lớn với giới hoạch định chính sách. Chẳng hạn như ông Hadjim Djalal của Indonesia nằm trong ban cố vấn của chính phủ về biển. Hay Tống Yến Huy của Đài Loan cũng nằm trong ban cố vấn của Đài Loan.

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Học giả Hadjim Djalal (chính giữa) là thành viên ban cố vấn về biển của chính phủ Indonesia. Ảnh: Huỳnh Phan

Tôi nhớ chính Cựu Giám đốc Học viện Ngoại giao Dương Văn Quảng, trong bài trả lời phỏng vấn báo Sài Gòn Tiếp Thị nhân hội thảo lần thứ nhất, có hy vọng rằng một trong những mục tiêu tổ chức hội thảo là giúp các nhà hoạch định chính sách của từng nước tranh chấp chủ quyền trên Biển Đông có những điều chỉnh chính sách nhất định. Nhưng dường như với Trung Quốc, hay Việt Nam, hai tay chơi quan trọng trong ván cờ này, mục tiêu này có vẻ không được thể hiện rõ ràng lắm?

Tôi nghĩ có chứ, ở mức độ nào đấy.

Với Trung Quốc, đầu tiên họ khẳng định vùng nước bên trong đường lưỡi bò là vùng nước lịch sử, theo chế độ nội thủy - tức là các nước đi qua phải xin phép. Nhưng khi các nước phản đối quá nhiều, đặc biệt trong các hội thảo về biển Đông, sau đó, Trung Quốc bắt đầu đưa ra quan điểm nhẹ nhàng hơn, ví dụ như phát biểu của Ngô Sỹ Tồn.

Ông này cho rằng, TQ không đưa ra yêu sách chủ quyền với toàn bộ các vùng nước nằm bên trong đường lưỡi bò, mà chỉ yêu sách như đường qui thuộc các đảo bên trong. Tham vọng vẫn vậy, nhưng cách yêu sách có mềm dẻo hơn.

Hay với Việt Nam, bây giờ mình nhấn mạnh nhiều hơn đến yêu sách vùng đặc quyền kinh tế 200 hải lý, dựa theo công ước luật biển. Mặc dù, việc khẳng định chủ quyền với hai quần đảo này là không thay đổi.

Rồi quan điểm của nhiều nhà nghiên cứu Việt Nam (mặc dù không chính thức) vẫn cho rằng các đảo ở Hoàng Sa và Trường Sa không được coi là đảo theo điều 121 Công ước luật biển, tức là không có vùng đặc quyền kinh tế xung quanh. Tức là mình cũng phải điều chỉnh yêu sách của mình.

Tôi có trao đổi với những học giả quốc tế như Hadjim Djalal, Daniel Schaeffer, hay Stein Tonnesson, và họ đều nói rằng rất khó khai thác những nguồn tư liệu nghiên cứu ở Việt Nam. Vậy những hội thảo vừa rồi có giúp họ điều đó không, thông qua các trao đổi bên lề giữa họ và chúng ta?

Các nghiên cứu của chúng ta vẫn còn nặng về "đóng cửa đọc cho nhau nghe".

Tôi có dự một hội thảo quốc tế của Viện Khoa học Xã hội Việt Nam tổ chức vào năm ngoái, các đại biểu của Trung Quốc cũng bảo rằng có lẽ nên tổ chức một cuộc tọa đàm riêng giữa các nhà luật học của Việt Nam và Trung Quốc, cũng như giữa các nhà sử học Việt Nam và Trung Quốc, trao đổi với nhau về lập trường của đôi bên. Rất tiếc là chưa có tiến triển gì kể từ đó.

Ông có đọc trên Tuanvietnam về cuộc trao đổi giữa Việt Nam và Trung Quốc ở Nhật Bản không?

Tôi có được đọc gần như toàn văn của các bài tham luận trong cuộc trao đổi đó. Tôi nghĩ rằng những trao đổi như vậy thực sự cần thiết và bổ ích.

Nếu các chính khách khó có thể phát biểu thẳng thắn về những vấn đề nhạy cảm, tế nhị với nhau, thì các nhà khoa học có thể cùng nhau thẳng thắn trao đổi. Từ đó, có thể tìm ra những điểm chung, và có thể đưa ra những phương cách để làm giảm bớt mâu thuẫn, xung đột.

Xin cảm ơn ông.

Huỳnh Phan

nguon

 

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